Charities

[007paul007]

Is 10 supporting any charities or have SM supported any charities in previous events ? I know others have donated proceeds from the odd thing or two, so I am just wondering if SM have done so in the past are thinking about it in the future, especially with Children In Need just around the corner, or maybe other charities local or main ones ?

[Raylenth]

OT but when is CiN Paul? I'll have to get baking some cakes and biscuits to sell at work.

[007paul007]

It's on Friday 17th November !

[Raylenth]

ta

[007paul007]

No Probs glad to be of service lol

[Crostini]

thats still way over a month after the event. Its not really a convention that donates but more like gives to the people who collect.

[DavidB]

I'm sure sometimes some of the costume people do stuff for charity? Can't say for sure but I have some kinda recollection of it.

[007paul007]

I've been at other events where certain things have been for charity, for example a dinner the night before, with proceeds from the tickets going to a charity, sometimes there is an auction. I have also seen photo shoots being done, where you can have pictures taking with stormtroopers, Darth Vader, Daleks etc and the proceeds going to Children In Need, Children in Need has events going on all year to raise money for it, just because C10 is little early in some peoples eyes doesn't mean that is an excuse to do it, as I say an event elsewhere recently was doing something for CIN, and another event is doing something for it and have just announced it as well.

[chris_mk]

I know there was a stall at the last comic con, that was raising money for Cancer Research and Equality Now (Joss Whedon's charity of choice). I'm not sure what arrangement they had with SM.

[007paul007]

I knwo at one of the SM events Gates Mecfadden had a big poster signed picture, you could have for a higher price and the money was going to a charity she was supporting, but that is about it as far as I can recall personally.

[Crostini]

its up to SM whether or not they do it.

Write to them and i'm sure Andrea, Davey or Chief will tell you whether or not they are going to do something

[007paul007]

Just curious thats all, most of all the other events do something or another for charities at an event or dinner, and one place has done something for Children In Need the last couple of years, even charity auctions, I would guess it is down to the organisers as to whether they are going to do anything, I might drop them a line, but i always think its best that if an organisation does it off its own back instead of being asked, it shows they are really behind the charity they are supporting.

[007paul007]

Also you have a chance of getting more stars when an event is doing something for charity.

[showmasters]

Also you have a chance of getting more stars when an event is doing

something for charity.

 

 

Thank you Paul for your input. As always an interesting post.

 

To answer some of your more recent questions

 

Yes, we do support charities. We get approached by charities each and every

show, sometimes up to 40 odd organisations, some real and bona fide, and

sadly some fake. So we now ask organisations to contact us way before the

event, to give us time to verify them. We choose one or two of them to work

with, but we DO NOT make a big thing of it. We don't feel the need to go out

and tell everybody how good or nice or kind we are, so you will not normally

see anything on here about what we have done. Nor do we promote a particular

charity as we would soon be inundated by other organisations wanting similar

publicity, which we would not be able to do

for all of them

 

"I always think its best that an organisation does it off its own back

instead of being asked" WE AGREE

 

On a personal note we like to support charities that actually helps a

individual so it actually makes a difference to that person's life, but that

is down to us.

 

I have seen recently that you really have a lot of opinions about a lot of

subjects, which is okay by me, but I must say that you do not seem to listen

to others too well, and you also seem to stick rigidly to your own opinion,

so let me explain to you something so you can understand it, because you

keep bringing it up in other posts.

 

We DO NOT allow the promotion of other events on this forum and these are

the reasons why:

 

We are a business and employ many people who rely on us to pay wages so they

can get through life

 

Myself and Andrea enjoy what we do. We choose to do this not because we have

to, but because we love doing it.

 

Showmasters spends more on advertising events of this kind than any other

organisation IN THE WORLD.

 

Because of this we do not feel it is fair to allow the promotion of other

events when

 

1 they do not spend anywhere near as much as we do

 

2 they do not allow us to promote our events on their sites

 

3 this is a business and as such they are in competition with us, even

though we are the largest company in the field. You would not see Tescos

letting Sainburys piggyback on their advertising.

 

4 and actually we do promote some events, but that are friends of us. It is

down to us to choose who we help and support. We pay the bills and undewrite

the losses here at Showmasters, and there have been lots of those, so that

choice is the luxury we have.

 

I would like to point out some important things

 

Before we started Collectormania no organisation in the world came close to

the amount of guests we bring to the fans in a year and if we ceased to

exist there is no other company out there to replace us; as Showmasters to

date has not made profit and is underwritten by myself and Andrea we feel

that we have contributed a lot to many thousands of fans having the best

days of their lives. This is something that we are very proud of and want to

keep on doing, because we enjoy it.

 

Also if we ceased to exist we would not have got to meet all of our friends

who help us run these events. The crew are not just people that work with

us, THEY ARE FAMILY and they are the best friends and crew you could ask

for.

 

So as I see it, we stop the promotion of other events so we can continue to

run events so we can see and meet up with our frinds, do a job we love, keep

friends in their jobs, to give as many fans as we can some of the best

memories of their lives, and give people the opportunity to meet guests who

will not always be around forever - like Pat Morita, the fans loved to meet

him but some of you may not know he was amazed that so many fans wanted to

meet him. It made him feel really wanted and appreciated.

 

So Paul I hope you can see its not just a selfish act or just a business

competition thing. In fact it is a whole lot of things, and if we have rules

on the forum or at the show, they are there for a really good reason, as we

at Showmasters think things through thoroughly and that is why the events go

quite well and we have many satisfied customers.

 

One last thing. If people have a good time they generally do not write to

you saying so, but if they do not like something they will complain and

write to us. Collectormainia Milton Keynes has around 350 to 600,000

visitors over 4 days - thats like 8 Wembley Queen concerts, and at the last

mk event we had 4 complaints and 2 of those were down to us. So we do still

have room to improve.

 

Thank you for your time and I hope you can see it from our point of view

 

Jason Joiner on behalf of the Showmasters family

[TurkFox]

*glomps Jason*

 

AMAZINGLY well said!

[007paul007]

Jason

 

Thankyou for taking the time to reply and I am glad that you have decided at long last to talk about the things you do for charity, I already know the charities you have supported, I could list them if you want. I agree unfornately that there are some fake charities, which can sometimes ruin things for the rest that are genuine. I have my opinions, just like yours and others on these boards. I always tend to give an honest answer.

 

Funny you should mention Queen, I saw them twice at Wembley stadium and also I was at the Live Aid event, so I know where you are coming from on that score, a shame there was only one Freddie and there will never be another.

 

I also am glad you mentioned about not doing it for profit and run at a loss, sometimes, surely this could be a problem in the long run, if you keep making more losse's, does this effect the stars decision to come or not and eventually, you cannot keep running and making losse's.

 

As for the amount of money spent, it's not how much is spent but how you spend it and I trust you are spending it wisely.

 

You also mention that it is not your policy to advertise competitors on this site and vice versa, but why is it ok to go to opponents shows and advertise your events by handling out leaflets etc, surely this is contradicting yourselves in some way , and I know you are not the only ones to do it.

 

 

As for paying more than anyone in the world for advertising, I know you will realise no matter how much you spend be it the most or the least, it never seems enough and there are always people that don't know it is on.

 

I know the work force is like a family and that is great, but i hope you understand where I am coming from when i say to some it can look like an closed circle, for some people that have not worked for you that is or someone that is new.

 

Anyway thankyou for coming forward and saying your piece, I am glad that other users off this board, can see what you do and think.

[TommyT]

You also mention that it is not your policy to advertise competitors on this site and vice versa, but why is it ok to go to opponents shows and advertise your events by handling out leaflets etc, surely this is contradicting yourselves in some way , and I know you are not the only ones to do it.

Please allow me to speculate. It's a matter of "convention" and what you can and can't control. Obviously many potential "customers" go to similar shows run by others. It would therefore seem that they are potentially fruitful places to canvas. It seems to be a generally accepted (or at least implemented) practice that you can't advertise on other people's websites, and they have the ability to control that, as they do within their event. (If Jason or somebody else pays fpor a website, or for a venue for an event, why should he let people use what he's paid for to advertise their business for free? And it's good manners not to offend the host.). However, it is perfectly legal to stand on public land outside said venue and hand out promotional material, and given that it's an area that will see many target customers pass by, it's probably a smart place to advertise. I would suggest that it's considerably better targetted marketing than handing out fliers outside a Millwall FC game or a Motorhead gig.

Consider again the supermarket analogy. If Tesco have a big offer on chocolate muffins, it may well appeal to people who buy chocolate muffins at Sainsburys. Now Tesco can't go and advertise in Sainsbury's "forum" or put up posters inside Sainsburys. And Sainsburys aren't going to let Tescos advertise in their free give away magazine, are they? But there's nothing to stop Tescos folk standing outside Sainsburys and handing leaflets to potential customers, is there?

Handing out leaflets outside somebody else's show isn't a contradiction, it's just sensible advertising within reasonable guidelines.

As another analogy, if I go to see a band, I don't mind being given a flier outside the gig for other upcoming concerts by other bands. But I'll be damn annoyed if somebody gets up on stage in the middle of the headline band to read a list of other gigs out!

[A007]

Jason,

 

I agree with all of your points above. I would like to thank you (the SM family) for all the good times i have had at your events since C5.

 

Cheers

 

Aaron

Edited August 30, 2006 by A007

[007paul007]

Tommy T

 

Good points, I am glad that you also mention Tesco and Sainsbury. Firstly leaflets were being handed out insdie other events and not outside and if you take the same business, I don't think no one has ever seen Tesco handing out leaflets inside their rivals store, paid or unpaid, or even vice versa.

 

Outside I could understand but inside, now thats where it does bcome a bit contradicting, and sM are not the only ones to do it.

 

 

I have however seen in Tesco for example, and i am sure this has been in many other stores, a place where they have a trolley or a price list saying sainsbury, Asda etc, would charge you say £100, for this shopping but in this store, it costs £80 for example.

 

Tommy if it was outside, then I would agree with you but unfornately it is and as I say all the shows do this.

[mpharris]

Tommy T

 

Good points, I am glad that you also mention Tesco and Sainsbury. Firstly leaflets were being handed out insdie other events and not outside and if you take the same business, I don't think no one has ever seen Tesco handing out leaflets inside their rivals store, paid or unpaid, or even vice versa.

 

Outside I could understand but inside, now thats where it does bcome a bit contradicting, and sM are not the only ones to do it.

 

 

I have however seen in Tesco for example, and i am sure this has been in many other stores, a place where they have a trolley or a price list saying sainsbury, Asda etc, would charge you say £100, for this shopping but in this store, it costs £80 for example.

 

Tommy if it was outside, then I would agree with you but unfornately it is and as I say all the shows do this.

 

But surely the fact that it is inside makes it more legitimate. If they were doing it outside it would be a sneaky, underhand act but the fact that it is inside means that SM have paid the organisers of the other show to have a stall and that the other show's organisers are aware of what SM are doing and have no problem with it.

[Too Tall]

SM have paid to be "inside" the event. They have PAID the event organiser to be there. They have paid for a stall. The event organiser is fully aware of why SM are going to be there, and obviously feel that the money they are paid by SM for advertising at their show is worth any loss in business it may cause. That is their decision.

 

SM are not getting anything for free, and that's the point. SM aren't willing to let other companies advertise on they site/forum for "free". They pay for advertising so why shouldn't others.

 

So I don't see the contradiction?

 

I'd also like to point out that no other event run forum will let you name other events either. This is not just a Showmasters thing, all events do it. On one I know "Milton Keynes" is auto replaced with ****, and you will get banned on the spot for posting Showmasters name. Obviously this is auto replaced too, but we all know it's possible to get around that, "$howmasters" for instance.

 

I have however seen in Tesco for example, and i am sure this has been in many other stores, a place where they have a trolley or a price list saying sainsbury, Asda etc, would charge you say £100, for this shopping but in this store, it costs £80 for example.

This is Tesco's saying they are better than Asda, they are not advertising Asda in a good way. It would be like the other event giving out leaflets saying "We have the same guests but they'll be cheaper than at an Showmasters event". That's not helping SM, that's degrading them. That's what Tescos are doing to Asda in your example. I don't see this has anything to do with your point? Tescos are not helping Adsa!

Edited August 30, 2006 by Too Tall

[007paul007]

Too Tall

 

I see your point, but I still see it as being contradicting, sorry we cannot have you mentioned on our site, but if you pay at our event then you can stand there and advertise by giving leaflets out.

 

People have used Tesco's and Sainsbury as a business to demonstrate the fact, may I then ask this question, if Tesco said to asda, lets pay you so we can hand out leaflets in your store, do you think in good business prospects that in Asda will say yes > In the real world they would no ?

 

 

Mpharris

 

Good point about things not being sneaky and being open, I agree but you have things where for example people join rival event forums under a different user name, say a friends or girlfriends etc, and I am not just saying normal members, but moderators etc. Nothing wrong with this, people can do and join what they want, under whatever name they want, but some do it just to be sneaky and get info. Yes things should be in the open and it has really pleased me for Jason to admit about helping charities, i find some people give moe when they know there is a charity involved, and SM have my full backing for that !

 

i am also glad it is run by normal people who class themselves as a familt, with love, arguements, fun and all the things that go into a family.

[DavidB]

To be honest, most of us know that this argument crops up every so often on here, and those who are against the "censoring" of other events don't change their minds even when it's explained fully.

 

Paying for advertising is a lot different to giving away free adverts/mentions on a forum. The other event doesn't even HAVE a forum (maybe one day but I don't think they do yet) and so SMs don't get free mentions on their site etc, so why should it be the case here? I don't see how anyone can see that as a contradiction or fail to understand the difference. If the opportunity to advertise is there, and they pay for the right, and the other event is happy to let it happen then that's fine. But until they stick Collectormania adverts on their website and have people discussing about the lineups etc then the situation regarding the event itself is totally different.

 

And yes, I see all the analogies as totally relevant. You won't get Tesco telling you to shop at Asda. You won't get Coca Cola telling you to go drink Pepsi. And you won't get Arsenal telling you to go support Chelsea. It's business, which these events are primarily anyway.

 

As others have said a million times before, and will continue to do so, it's not just on here that other events can't be mentioned/discussed, and if that's how event organisers wish to do it ACROSS THE BOARD then that's fair enough. I see no problem with it as there are plenty of other places that aren't affiliated with shows and offer the opportunity to discuss EVERYTHING.

[Too Tall]

Too Tall

 

I see your point, but I still see it as being contradicting, sorry we cannot have you mentioned on our site, but if you pay at our event then you can stand there and advertise by giving leaflets out.

It's not a contradiction. What you're saying is "You're allowed to PAY to advertise at the event, but we're not going to let you advertise for FREE on our website", that is not a contradiction. Can you not see the difference? One is being paid for and one is free!

 

It's like paying for guests autos. If a member of the public comes up and asks for an autograph and pays, fine. They've PAID, the crew are going to let them through. If the guest is going for a break and is walking through the hall and a member of the public walks up and asked the guest for a FREE autograph, the crew are going to stop them. They've not paid for the product. Is that a contradiction? No.

 

What is being said it that if you want to advertise you pay for it. That's it. Advertising has a price that should be paid. Events do not let others advertise for free. Posting their event on the forum is FREE advertising. That's what is being stopped. It is completely different to advertising that is being PAID for.

 

People have used Tesco's and Sainsbury as a business to demonstrate the fact, may I then ask this question, if Tesco said to asda, lets pay you so we can hand out leaflets in your store, do you think in good business prospects that in Asda will say yes > In the real world they would no ?

In the case you present there, no that is not likely to happen. But it is the decision of the other event to allow SM to advertise at their event. As I said before.....

The event organiser is fully aware of why SM are going to be there, and obviously feel that the money they are paid by SM for advertising at their show is worth any loss in business it may cause. That is their decision.

[TommyT]

Too Tall

I see your point, but I still see it as being contradicting, sorry we cannot have you mentioned on our site, but if you pay at our event then you can stand there and advertise by giving leaflets out.

As TT said, people paying for advertising is fine, people piggy-backing free advertising is not. Why should somebody else effectively pay for a facility for you to advertise freely?

(I caused no end of a stink at my local garage when my new car arrived and as well as their name being on the rear numberplate (which I'll acept, since they paid for them) and on a sticker in the back window (which I can remove), it was also tastefully painted in relatively small type on the bodywork. They thought that I'd be proud to display that I had purchased from such a prestigious establishment. I told them that they might think so, but as far as i was concerned I wasn't doing free advertising for them and they could get stuffed, as the car wasn't what I'd ordered. Or they could pay me a handsome sum for being their mobile billboard.)

People have used Tesco's and Sainsbury as a business to demonstrate the fact, may I then ask this question, if Tesco said to asda, lets pay you so we can hand out leaflets in your store, do you think in good business prospects that in Asda will say yes

They probably won't, but they are free to say yes and accept payment for doing so. The analogy here is not whether Asda will, but whether Asda can. Sure, if Tescos people randomly wander in and start leafleting, they'll get tossed, and rightly so. If they agree to purchase space from Asda for the purpose, they're entitled to advertise.