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GoldenGreen

Superman - Man of Steel

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Couldn't see a thread on this, but what did everyone think , without giving any spoilers away ?

 

One of the first movies I saw that wasn't Disney as a kid was Superman with Christopher Reeve so it was really interesting to go to this and take my son to his first non animated movie at the Cinema as well.

 

The words, rollercoaster and action packed spring to mind !

 

The time absolutely flew by and some great action sequences, thought Henry was good as Superman and Amy as Lois.

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I think Henry was a good Superman (I did miss the red pants!) But I didn't really like it.... I don't know why but I just didn't!

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The casting was superb - Cavill, Crowe, Shannon, Adams, Fishburne etc etc.

Visuals were stunning. Some of the action sequences had me really wowed....and then there were more, and more, and more and more of them.

The battle went on too long, I could no longer get excited about seeing Superman doing cool things (I was begging for some character development past the first hour).

Character actions were questionable, both in terms of the character lore and acceptable logical behaviour.

I could have let a lot of it slip, but the film overall was very loud and boring, a bit like the transformers sequels.

It's a shame as there was a lot there to like - too bad it was overwhelmed by Snyder's BIG and LOUD approach to everything.

Superman 1978 is still the best Superman movie folks.

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ive always liked the reeve superman films, but ive not watched for some time, i watched 1 before mos and id forgotten how much humour is in it, too much for me,

 

 

i LOVED MOS, yes its got loads of faults, a few hold on that doesnt make sense moments and too much CGI esp at the end. it also lacks a theme for superman, its main theme which i love seemed to be either zods theme or the "action" theme which is fine but supes doesnt have his own theme, crazy not to include one and a touch of the classic score.

 

but over all I loved it, action, emotion, HEART! all in all I think its the best superman on screen depiction, take away nostalgia and love of reeve and I think most wold agree. BUT yes it does have faults. deff too much cgi in scenes that could have been done with far less and been just as good if not better.

 

----

 

very slight spoilers

 

 

....................

 

 

 

costmer stole the show and that scene was very emotional.

 

I liked how they made the flash backs non linier, at first i was like huh thats weird but I liked it, kept it moving without getting boring

 

casting? cavil, lane and costner were brilliant as were crowe and Ayelet, and antje as faora, she was gorgeous and I really liked the character.

 

now amy adams as lois and shannon as zod, im not so sure. shannen was really good when he was doing it subtle, but (and this perhaps is more the script) when he was doing loud mad i lost a bit of interest.

 

adams, I dunno, she was ok, perhaps she needed more to say, not sure. she was ok.

 

really liked the last scene.

 

the end battle was action packed and really good (i liked the little sub bit with fishburne and co) BUT too much cgi and destruction. how many ppl died in all that? never touched upon.

 

last zod supes scene was really good i felt and made up for a bit too much cgi prior to it.

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It's a while since I've experienced such polarization of an audience to a summer blockbuster. People I speak to either say 'I loved it' or 'It was really awful.'

Having said that, I didn't dislike everything about it. Superman's first flying scene was superbly done. I was like, bouncing in my cinema seat and everything.

But I just wish there had been more of 'those' moments, where we feel Superman is a farmboy from Kansas discovering he can do wonderful things. Rather than a CG animated action figure bashing the hell out of everything in sight.

Also the line "You can save them Kal-El. You can save all of them" from Crowe was superb. A perfect moment in a far from perfect film.

Edited by crazydan182

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Superman is a classic, though if that film was to be held to todays overly expecting ideals, it would be torn to shreds.

It has many, many flaws that are overlooked as it's so iconic.

 

Man of Steel is the first film to readdress who, what and why Kal-El becomes humanities savour, it shows us the story set in todays world, one with hard and hash decisions and consequences.

It shows us how action or inaction would have an impact on them and the world at large.

 

In short it makes Superman relevant, something none have done before.

Edited by Brian Cairns

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The Alien trying to live among the humans was a good angle but is suddenly lost in the overly-long climactic battle (reminded me of Transformers: DOTM) . Cavill is good but there's chemistry severely lacking between he and Amy Adams (Lois Lane) and everyone else with each other for that matter. There's a few cop-outs too which just seemed like lazy screen-writing (eg. Jor-Els 'conscience'). And how the hell did Laurence Fishburne get so damn FAT?

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In short it makes Superman relevant, something none have done before.

 

The 1978 movie made Superman entirely relevant to that era. You're right, it doesn't hold up in today's world, but in '78, Superman The Movie was a mindblowing experience. Superman was depicted as the all American boy scout who always does the right thing, a characterisation relevant to a more innocent era for a less politically/morally tainted society.

MOS was not the first film to make Superman relevant.

 

Man of Steel does indeed bring the character into a modern setting. It does address why Kal-El becomes humanity's saviour (this time it's more crisis aversion, wheras in the '78 movie it's more like "they can be a great people if you help them out a bit"). But the new film has the mindset of "everyone's out to destroy America" (a sorely overrused cliche in modern cinema) wheras the original movie has the mindset of a flawed America, full of hopeful people with the potential to do good, led by a guiding influence. A more hopeful, original concept and another reason I prefer the '78 movie.

What I had a major issue with is the fact that MOS almost forgot to tell a story due to its preoccupation with CGI setpieces and unecessary destruction. Regardless of which version of the character you prefer, Superman in the '78 film has a more defined, deeply characterized role. And yes, that was partly because they were forced to use actors back then rather than computer animation.

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I realise I'm setting myself up for a heavy debate here, though i totally love the original Superman it is my first comic book film i ever saw it was an amazing film then and i still love to watch it now.

Though it was an epic for it's time i don't think Superman himself was relevant. The ideas and themes thoughout show the world though rose tinted glasses, the studio could have gone in a totally different direction since set in an age of paranoia of an "alien" invasion they missed the opportunity to provide a realistic approach to how humanity would actually deal with the information of an extraterrestrial with more than enough power to destroy the world several times over.

 

Lex Luther should be the hero seen by humanity as he dares to question whether Kal-El's intention is honourable or not (i hope that's the direction they take him in for the MoS sequel).

 

Superman is seen as far too much of a boy scout, as a comic book even at that point he was being given storylines that had more to it than just saving the day with a friendly wave. The film is iconic like i say, though it is flawed.

 

This is my opinion only, i don't mind you debating the points though i don't appreciate being told they are wrong. They are not wrong, just not yours!

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I can totally appreciate that. I wouldn't deny anyone the right to their opinion, but it doesn't make it any less fun to have a heated debate about the merits of a film :laugh:

I think the idea of focusing on Kal as an alien and setting up the whole 'first contact' with alien life as the origin story was genius, and makes the film more believable from the start. My problem being, the question of "how humanity would actually deal with the information of an extraterrestrial with more than enough power to destroy the world several times over" is never answered in MOS. Things are too busy exploding in the second half for anyone to get a line of constructive dialogue in edgeways, and humanity is about to be wiped out by Zod, so their options of trusting Superman or not are pretty redundant at that point. They have no choice, so the setup of the film is undermined by its conclusion. I appreciate this theme can and likely will be picked up in the sequel, but that doesn't change the fact that MOS has a weak final act.

 

Lex Luther should be the hero seen by humanity as he dares to question whether Kal-El's intention is honourable or not (i hope that's the direction they take him in for the MoS sequel).

 

I couldn't agree with you more. Perfect opportunity for a sequel. Have Superman doing his usual thing, saving people and developing his relationship with Lois Lane. Lex twists the situation in the background, convincing people that Superman causes bad things to happen (which is arguably true after MOS) and that he is the true threat. American military tries to take out Superman, Superman has to defend himself but is now unwilling to take another life out of principle. Superman reveals the true threat to be Lex and his scheme, redeems himself and saves the day.

At this point I'd see the sequel going in this direction, but likely with a secondary villain alongside Lex so they can avoid the 'kryptonite' scenario.

 

It's right that Superman should be doing more than just saving people (that happens a lot in the '78 film due to budget restrictions and technical ability more than anything else), but I feel any story like this deserves more substance in terms of character development and plot. MOS could have been great, if Zack Snyder knew how to dial the action back in favour of character. His films all seem to dial up to 11, and not come back down until the credits roll. A good story ebbs and flows.

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I can totally appreciate that. I wouldn't deny anyone the right to their opinion, but it doesn't make it any less fun to have a heated debate about the merits of a film :laugh:

I think the idea of focusing on Kal as an alien and setting up the whole 'first contact' with alien life as the origin story was genius, and makes the film more believable from the start. My problem being, the question of "how humanity would actually deal with the information of an extraterrestrial with more than enough power to destroy the world several times over" is never answered in MOS. Things are too busy exploding in the second half for anyone to get a line of constructive dialogue in edgeways, and humanity is about to be wiped out by Zod, so their options of trusting Superman or not are pretty redundant at that point. They have no choice, so the setup of the film is undermined by its conclusion. I appreciate this theme can and likely will be picked up in the sequel, but that doesn't change the fact that MOS has a weak final act.

 

Lex Luther should be the hero seen by humanity as he dares to question whether Kal-El's intention is honourable or not (i hope that's the direction they take him in for the MoS sequel).

 

I couldn't agree with you more. Perfect opportunity for a sequel. Have Superman doing his usual thing, saving people and developing his relationship with Lois Lane. Lex twists the situation in the background, convincing people that Superman causes bad things to happen (which is arguably true after MOS) and that he is the true threat. American military tries to take out Superman, Superman has to defend himself but is now unwilling to take another life out of principle. Superman reveals the true threat to be Lex and his scheme, redeems himself and saves the day.

At this point I'd see the sequel going in this direction, but likely with a secondary villain alongside Lex so they can avoid the 'kryptonite' scenario.

 

It's right that Superman should be doing more than just saving people (that happens a lot in the '78 film due to budget restrictions and technical ability more than anything else), but I feel any story like this deserves more substance in terms of character development and plot. MOS could have been great, if Zack Snyder knew how to dial the action back in favour of character. His films all seem to dial up to 11, and not come back down until the credits roll. A good story ebbs and flows.

 

Alright then, sorry if that came across a bit blunt, I've just had one too many debates turn into "I'm right and your wrong" type arguments.

 

I can totally see your point of view and i do agree, i actually wish Nolan had a bit more of an influence on the direction the film took as i do prefer a good character building story for an origin story, though loads of folk i know felt it had too much so i guess they did need to show Man of Steel was an action film more than anything else, i do think it's more of a good build up of the potential the sequel has over the story the film is telling itself. It's a great foundation on the reasons why Superman needs to hold back and not kill, because ultimately i always suspected Kal-El's true fear is that Lex Luther is right, he should be seen as a threat so he feels he is required to make great efforts of heroism to show he can and will do great good.

 

The sequel has the potential to be a much smarter film without taking away any dramatic action scenes. I actually think Lex could be the best main villain and maybe show military (a certain General Lane could provide conflict and threat for both Clark and Superman) taking percussions for future attacks on Earth, could be the perfect way to introduce a major weakness of Kryptonians as well as a heavy hitter for Superman, Metallo.

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I don't want Snyder to direct the sequel. I want him to get to work on Army of the Dead already.

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i dont want the sequel to be a supes and batman combo film!!!

 

 

*affleck will still be a great bat though

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It's an intersting notion - will it be a Supes vrs Batman or a tag team affair against a greater foe?

 

As for the Affleck argument... I think that the harder part to play is the Bruce Wayne aspect and he'll have the chops to put something extra into it - his career and repetoir have increased of late and I think he has the skills now.

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:no: I am a Superman fan and was really excited about Man Of Steel. I thought Returns was ok, too much of the romance in it but since Chris Reeve was so prefect it was going to hard to fill those shoes. So I gave Returns 7 out of 10. But Man Of Steel, well I liked the effects and Henry's chest :firedevil: was very nice, but this was all it had. There was no emotion in Superman. He just didn't seem to care. The main villain had more emotion than Superman. There is a moment were you discover that Zod was born into a soldier/warrior like class and was so designed and bred to be the way he is with no way of changing at all. So I kind of felt sorry for him to be like this and he appears to feel regret that he can't be like Superman who was born the normal way and had a choice to be what ever he wanted to be. So I felt sorry that Zod had to die like this. But Superman in the other films has emotion to not only defeat the bad guys but to try to protect the humans as much as possible. Zod in Superman 2 showed he had no time for these humans and all he wanted to do was to rule and bully. Zod in Man of Steel was there for Superman and it was Superman's fault that the destruction happened. So for this reason I give it 5 out of ten. :spew:

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Oh please if you do a Superman V Batman give it to someone else other than the Nolans. Ok their Batman was great, but they cast the same model with Superman. Superman is not dark and moody. He is a big boy scout. This is why Man Of Steel turned out so poor. Please also don't let Hans Zimmer do the music. Have you listened to it? I have the soundtrack on Cd and it has no theme and it is all the same boring notes over and over again. This is not how you do a superhero theme, don't like Danny Elfman, but his themes are better. :grump:

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ZOD would have done the same to any world he came across.

 

I thought there was emotion in superman.

 

thought it pissed all over returns.

 

 

its does have faults mind, the mindless destruction at the end and too much cgi being some.

 

i loved the theme from ziimmer, the problem with it is its unclear whos theme it is, is it zods? or a general action theme, cos a few times when supes is on it doesnt play but does in other action beats and for zod. so i agree more better themes was needed, but the one thats there, even though its not clear what theme it is for, is a decent one.

 

it does really need to weeve in the classic theme though.

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ZOD would have done the same to any world he came across.

 

I thought there was emotion in superman.

 

thought it pissed all over returns.

 

 

its does have faults mind, the mindless destruction at the end and too much cgi being some.

 

i loved the theme from ziimmer, the problem with it is its unclear whos theme it is, is it zods? or a general action theme, cos a few times when supes is on it doesnt play but does in other action beats and for zod. so i agree more better themes was needed, but the one thats there, even though its not clear what theme it is for, is a decent one.

 

it does really need to weeve in the classic theme though.

 

I have to agree. Much better than Returns.

 

Man of Steel was one of the best films I have seen this year. Loads of emotion. Loved the soundtrack. Zod was especially evil.

 

Although I'm not sure if a Supes vs Batman is a good idea.

I look forward to being wrong and I hope it's a great film.

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ZOD would have done the same to any world he came across.

 

I thought there was emotion in superman.

 

thought it pissed all over returns.

 

 

its does have faults mind, the mindless destruction at the end and too much cgi being some.

 

i loved the theme from ziimmer, the problem with it is its unclear whos theme it is, is it zods? or a general action theme, cos a few times when supes is on it doesnt play but does in other action beats and for zod. so i agree more better themes was needed, but the one thats there, even though its not clear what theme it is for, is a decent one.

 

it does really need to weeve in the classic theme though.

Yes I kind of understand.... I just loved the Chris Reeve Superman so much that nothing else will ever be good enough for me. But I will watch Man Of Steel again and maybe like Ironman 2 which I watched a few times before I liked it, it will grow on me. But I will not ever like the Hans Zimmer theme. Buy the soundtrack on cd and listen to it. It is the same all the way through and yes what is it, Superman's theme or Zod's theme. Then compare it to the Williams score of Superman the Movie and even the Returns score and you will see it is too Batman like to be Superman like. But I am a Superman fan, I am going to get the film when it comes out and will watch it many times cos I love Superman. Maybe in a year I will up my rating for the film. It is just that I compare it to the first man to put on the suit on the big screen and I was six when I saw this.

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I enjoyed it, was a little over reliant on its effects, but generally it was a good modern story about Superman's origins and I look forward to Superman Vs Batman.

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ZOD would have done the same to any world he came across.

 

I thought there was emotion in superman.

 

thought it pissed all over returns.

 

 

its does have faults mind, the mindless destruction at the end and too much cgi being some.

 

i loved the theme from ziimmer, the problem with it is its unclear whos theme it is, is it zods? or a general action theme, cos a few times when supes is on it doesnt play but does in other action beats and for zod. so i agree more better themes was needed, but the one thats there, even though its not clear what theme it is for, is a decent one.

 

it does really need to weeve in the classic theme though.

Yes I kind of understand.... I just loved the Chris Reeve Superman so much that nothing else will ever be good enough for me. But I will watch Man Of Steel again and maybe like Ironman 2 which I watched a few times before I liked it, it will grow on me. But I will not ever like the Hans Zimmer theme. Buy the soundtrack on cd and listen to it. It is the same all the way through and yes what is it, Superman's theme or Zod's theme. Then compare it to the Williams score of Superman the Movie and even the Returns score and you will see it is too Batman like to be Superman like. But I am a Superman fan, I am going to get the film when it comes out and will watch it many times cos I love Superman. Maybe in a year I will up my rating for the film. It is just that I compare it to the first man to put on the suit on the big screen and I was six when I saw this.

 

I really wanted to like Man of Steel. But I though it tried to hard to be 'epic'. Unlike Christopher Reeves Superman, I just didn't care for Cavill enough to root for him. I would have loved it to have at least incorporated a slight variation of the classic superman theme. Man that music's great.

 

DC seem to be trying too hard to copy the Marvel movie universe.

Edited by Matthewman

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Right I have watched Man Of Steel again and it was much better this time round. I watched it without trying to compare it to my favourite of all time Chris Reeve which is always hard to do. I have to concede it is a great movie and I take back some of the things I said about it and why I thought it was bad. Yes I can see that Superman does show concern for the earthers and does care. It was just all surrounded in all that dread and destruction. And in 3D too. And I often do find that I enjoy films more in the comfort of my own home and not at the cinema. So I will be watching it again and it will grow on me. Still think Chris Reeve rules though but for this new wave of modern superheroes I guess MOS is pretty damn good. :thumbup:

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