very important information to all Autographica attendees

[keithporter23]

(EDIT: Just noticed your reason 7 Jason - I have to say this issue is more important than any show being organised. Best wishes and thoughts to all who put together these shows for us, and thank you for enriching our lives with great experiences).

 

 

 

All will be forgiven if you give us MORE THAN 1 Hollywood legend to meet at the next show.

 

Good luck in 2011 ShowMasters; I think all our businesses will need it more than ever this year. It is going to be tougher than 2010 and I will support the events as much as possible.

Edited January 19, 2011 by keithporter23

[Count Fooku]

I think this is one of those situations where we have to accept that Showmasters are in possession of more facts about the show and the possibility of getting the right quality of guests to come along than we are. I'm sure the decision wasn't taken lightly and if there are other factors such as those alluded to by Jason in his post then I think that also needs to be respected.

 

Just one comment on the ticket sales though, because of the range of ticket options, it's not always easy to judge what the right ticket to buy is before there have been a decent number of guests announced. For example if there was to be another astronaut heavy line-up then I would go for a deluxe pass as I like to get photoshoots with astronauts, if someone like Gene Cernan or Jim Lovell came back then I would be very tempted by a VIP pass because I would like to get a place on their table at dinner. For other shows it might be that a one day or weekend pass would suffice but until there is an indication as to who will be there it's hard to commit to buying one type of ticket over another.

 

This isn't a complaint by the way, just giving a perspective from the other side of the fence!

[keithporter23]

 

Just one comment on the ticket sales though, because of the range of ticket options, it's not always easy to judge what the right ticket to buy is before there have been a decent number of guests announced. For example if there was to be another astronaut heavy line-up then I would go for a deluxe pass as I like to get photoshoots with astronauts, if someone like Gene Cernan or Jim Lovell came back then I would be very tempted by a VIP pass because I would like to get a place on their table at dinner. For other shows it might be that a one day or weekend pass would suffice but until there is an indication as to who will be there it's hard to commit to buying one type of ticket over another.

 

This isn't a complaint by the way, just giving a perspective from the other side of the fence!

 

100% agreed

[indio]

hi all

 

i understand that people will be unhappy what ever we do , we have all relised over the years we can not make everyone happy so all we do is our best , and we do this every day and at every show so if our best is not good enuff for some of you i am sorry for that .

 

i can give you some more inside infomation that my help you all understand why this has came around

 

1 there was no Apollo guest around to attend this May's event no one could make it so we were with out a big

space guest

 

2 ticket sales for this event so far were the lowest they have ever been 3 months out 22 tickets , so it was 22

of you that committed to the event , and i think you for that commitment and you will get a refund or if you

want to transfer the ticket over we will be happy to do that for you .

 

3 more people have attended Autographica in the south , so to make the next event "the only one of the year"

be the best we need to run it were the most people would attend , the Rad hotel has has the busiest

Autographica in the past .

 

4 also the date for the Oct show was booked some time ago and deposit has been paid so to change , so to

change it would cost us even more .

 

5 the date for the birmingham show were also only 3 months out and as we know that no Apollo guests are

around for it it also did not make sense to keep this event out of the two of them

 

6 we are not running Autographica in Birmingham for this year i did not say we would not be coming back next

year at all so do not worry , this year is a tuff year lots of people are finding it hard to pay to go to all the

events so to have just one event this year we do feel that is the best way to be able to bring you the best

show we can for 2011

 

7 this is a sensitive one , we are a team here it takes Paul,Dave and myself to run Autographica and at this

time some of us have some issues were family members are very unwell i do not want to go into this as its

privet stuff but we are real people and also have to deal with real life issues that do come first , things are

hard on this front as well and this also stops us putting in 100% on guest booking , so i hope you all

understand were i am coming from on this and see that lots of things are against us on this May date so all

in all i know we have done the best thing for you the fans and for the show its self by going for the Oct date .

 

 

i understand that this will not make everyone happy but all i can say is sorry and we do our best but some times we have to do things that are hard , i know no one here want to cancel the May show if we did not have to but this year this is the best way forward .

 

i hope to see you in october

 

sincerely

 

jason

7. say no more, had the same issues myself last year and was unable to attend collectormania on 27th nov. not been to a show since last september. my thoughts go out to you on this. health comes first. sincerely indio

[Avengers7]

ho and one last thing we are working on rebooking the guests that were to attend the show into the nest event and have the first of our new guest up in the next few weeks .

 

jason

 

 

Thats good news.

[machbusterman]

I think one event per year is better... it allows one to save up more to spend at the event after all. And for people flying in from wherever it means only one flight and hotel room required.... so from my point of view one show per year is better... and at Heathrow makes it easier to get to (more flights). Those from the Midlands that take the hump about the cancelation should think about the people that have had to travel from much further afield to attend. I've driven down from Scotland to attend 2 shows (Birmingham and Coventry) and flown to the others. Every time I the show was in Brum I had a real chew on with flights (not early enough in the morning or late enough in the evening).

 

Hope you guys get some great guests to attend.... and roll-on October!!

 

- Derek

[shearwater]

Hmmmmm.... Well we can all understand one or other of the organisers being distracted by an illness in the family, but I think an attack on us, the loyal attendee base of the event for not booking tickets in advance of ANY guest announcements is a trifle thoughtless.

Would you pre-pay for a dinner only to be told that the beef wellington didn't turn up, but there was some beans on toast available?

No Apollo guest available for May? Then how come Ed Mitchell announced his attendance on his website? Also: it is unrealistic to expect people tp pay tickets / accomodation / travel UNTIL some guests are announced. Why would ANYONE shell out a couple of hundred quid with only a few minor Bond girls and Kenny Baker again? I for one would have booked the whole weekend IF a few Astronauts had been announced before Christmas.

Lastly, the 'one show a year' issue is only relevant if the organisers are relying on the same old regulars turning up. The lifeblood of ANY event is new customers: SM don't seem to be attracting new attendees. In my own field I spend a small fortune canvassing / advertising / generating new leads.....

Edited January 19, 2011 by shearwater

[Queen_Sindel]

Hmmmmm.... Well we can all understand one or other of the organisers being distracted by an illness in the family, but I think an attack on us, the loyal attendee base of the event for not booking tickets in advance of ANY guest announcements is a trifle thoughtless.

 

I apologize if this came over the wrong way because I know it was not meant to be an attack.

 

There were several references that the Birmingham show was quite popular and that many attendees had booked already. To me it looks Jason gave that number of tickets sold to show that there just were just not as many bookings as one might expect.

[showmasters]

Hmmmmm.... Well we can all understand one or other of the organisers being distracted by an illness in the family, but I think an attack on us, the loyal attendee base of the event for not booking tickets in advance of ANY guest announcements is a trifle thoughtless.

Would you pre-pay for a dinner only to be told that the beef wellington didn't turn up, but there was some beans on toast available?

No Apollo guest available for May? Then how come Ed Mitchell announced his attendance on his website? Also: it is unrealistic to expect people tp pay tickets / accomodation / travel UNTIL some guests are announced. Why would ANYONE shell out a couple of hundred quid with only a few minor Bond girls and Kenny Baker again? I for one would have booked the whole weekend IF a few Astronauts had been announced before Christmas.

Lastly, the 'one show a year' issue is only relevant if the organisers are relying on the same old regulars turning up. The lifeblood of ANY event is new customers: SM don't seem to be attracting new attendees. In my own field I spend a small fortune canvassing / advertising / generating new leads.....

 

 

'shearwater' no one is attacking anyone ? i do not get were you got that from ? we are being cool and we are not blaming anyone for any thing .

 

as to "one organisers being distracted by an illness in the family" sorry mate its not one organiser its two ok, and its serious so i think you should just stay well away from this ok ,and i really think you should not go down this road its really not nice ok .

 

well i hope your "own field" dose well this year , but you do not know what we do to promote our events and we do keep getting new people attending but as you may know as new people come we loos some of the older collectors and as this event is very specialised its not like promoting the next IPad of computer Game the collectors out there are hard to target as they come from all walks of life , and as we spend more on ads than any other collectors events in the field i do not think we can spend any more on paid for ads , and maybe you should know that Autographica rarely makes a profit as thats not what we are in it for , most money that comes in go's on flights and costs , its a labour of love not profit .

 

i must say 'shearwater' your post come over as very angry ? maybe you should just relax as this is a hobby and it should be fun ? maybe i have read this wrong ? if i have sorry ?

 

jason

[malc75]

I swear not a few months ago there were people complaining about the quality of Autographica line-ups, and suggestions that they should just concentrate on one Autographica event per year and try for a really good line-up for it. Now they announce that they're going to do exactly that... and people still complain. Guess there really is no pleasing people...

 

(And I'd guess they chose London over Birmingham for it as it means that guests flown in from abroad only have very minimal travelling to do on this side of the flight, which can only be a good thing for the more elderly or frail guests.)

 

They do have an airport in Birmingham!

too right mr bear as usual we have to bow down to london again!at least we will save some money!

[adriangill]

too right mr bear as usual we have to bow down to london again!at least we will save some money!

In case you missed it - Jason has given several explanations in post 23 of this topic which may help you understand some of the reasons for the decision.

[TerraHawk]

There were several references that the Birmingham show was quite popular and that many attendees had booked already. To me it looks Jason gave that number of tickets sold to show that there just were just not as many bookings as one might expect.

 

To be honest prebuying a ticket for these types of event is least of my priorities. Hotels have limited cheap rooms for availibilty, trains have limited seats at a the lowest price - I wouldn't even look at getting a ticket before I had those two sorted. No point getting a ticket for an event you can't get to. And by that point its usually just as easy to buy on the door.

 

is a hobby and it should be fun ? maybe i have read this wrong ? if i have sorry ?

 

With the costs invloved for some of us its a fine line between hobby and chore. But once you start its almost an addiction.

 

It should be fun. I wouldn't go if I didn't enjoy my time at them. But when you have to navigate public transport 4 hours travel each way by train its not without its stresses (especially if you have two events you are intending to be at the same weekend) each time after rushing around, I think I'm getting too old for this.

 

As it happens I am in London the weekend of the next event, it could be to your advantage - if any of your guests suit my needs I may pop in enroute. I would have done with the last Invasion had that not been cancelled. *Edited to remove other event hint, sorry, we cant do that on the forum*

 

* reply to edit - to say - that removal makes it sound far more intriguing than what I wrote in the first place. I'm in London that weekend to attend something. If I saw such an edit on someone elses post I'd now actively look up other events for the same day. I've learnt of more events that way than any hints - intended or otherwise - ever tell me *

 

And it stops being fun when you realise you've wasted money on trains you don't need. It makes you more wary. Get there and stay there as cheap as possible (Gives me more money to spend with you at event )

 

But money on a wasted train, is like throwing it down the drain.

Edited January 20, 2011 by TerraHawk

[adriangill]

There were several references that the Birmingham show was quite popular and that many attendees had booked already. To me it looks Jason gave that number of tickets sold to show that there just were just not as many bookings as one might expect.

To be honest prebuying a ticket for these types of event is least of my priorities. Hotels have limited cheap rooms for availibilty, trains have limited seats at a the lowest price - I wouldn't even look at getting a ticket before I had those two sorted. No point getting a ticket for an event you can't get to. And by that point its usually just as easy to buy on the door.

That's fair enough. I expect there are an average amount of people who buy on the day, and likewise who pre-order. As Queen_Sindel has mentioned, going by the post from Jason this expected average number of pre-orders is considerably lower than normal. Which on it's own may not be reason for a cancellation (definitely a casue for concern though) but add in the other factors and unfortunately.....

[madmilburn]

With point 7 its fair to say we cant and shouldn't argue as end day there are other things more important, might be hard to believe but its true.

 

Before the points were listed it did feel a bit of 'The North (practically) nil vs The South several. Couple points made about money, what IF showmasters reduced autographica once yearly with it going london-brum-london-brum? Also having nxt one in october not prove difficult for some what with having media show month after, as several points have been made about some the distancing inbetween the events (not that am saying people go to all them, not that its impossible)

Edited January 19, 2011 by madmilburn

[shearwater]

Angry? No Dave / Jason, not at all....

But a little disappointed.

1) No available space guests? Mitchell had already announced his attendance and Liebergot has repeatedly posted elsewhere that he'd've been happy to be invited.

2) The Hilton show was confirmed back in the Autumn: you can't really criticise people for not pre-booking when there were no really 'meaty' guests on the site during the ensuing three months. None of my business, but if it'd been me, I'd have tried for a BIG name (Schweikart, Schmitt, Gordon, Cernan, Bean etc etc) before confirming the date. The Spring show doesn't have to be in early May. after all.

3) Obviously I have no knowledge of your finances, but possibly the 'glitzy' side of things such as the Gala Dinner could've been shelved during this 'difficult time' to make the weekend more affordable to you and to attendees.

4) There are lots of smaller rooms at the Hilton: maybe you could've gone for a smaller, more compact show just this once: just Astronauts / Aviators giving talks, autographs and photo-ops. SMs organise a number of events for fans of TV and film personalities: this might have been an opportunity to bring back the 'specialness' of the original shows. Perhaps it might be time to separate the film stars from the few remaining astronauts. Let's be frank: it's the space guests that have pulled in the serious money in the past: perhaps a space-only, once a year event on the right scale might be the way forward.

The Apollo astronauts were mostly test pilots and serious-minded engineers / scientists: I've always found they prefer to be treated with some deference. (At one of the shows I overheard an attendee say to Capt Haise: "Hey Freddo! How the *Beep* are you?" This said a lot about the inability of some people to differentiate between Hollywood and reality.

To summarise: if for future events you can make early announcements of aerospace guests of a high calibre at a venue that provides value for money for people choosing to stay, while reassuring people that the guest list is DEFINITE (barring unforeseen withdrawals) I don't doubt that the show can survive and even flourish. If that is YOUR wish, gentlemen!

Edited January 20, 2011 by Rhianydd

[adriangill]

Unfortunately no matter where an event is located you will have the people who are right 'next door' being very happy. Then the happiness level decreases the further you get away. Personally I would love an event around Bristol/Cardiff. Birmingham is closer for me but surprisingly I find the M4 better for traffic than the M5/M42 at weekends so not much difference timewise. No doubt people at Devon/Cornwall would liek an event as well, and so on.

 

There is no magic solution to this. Yes you can have events at different locations help alleviate this. Which then throws up the next issue "They had 'insert name' at that 'where ever' and we only have 'insert name' at ours!".

 

There isn't a deliberate Birmingham/London-North/South divide. It is just a set of circumstances.

 

The location can't be an easy thing to get right. I'm not sure if there is a right solution as, unintentionally, there will always be people who feel...'left out.

Edited January 20, 2011 by 1of2

[dragonsanddaffodils]

I dont believe that differentiating between space guests and Hollywood guests would cause bad language

 

(which, I am sorry, is not allowed on the forum, so please dont be offended that I slightly altered your post, removing one letter is not sufficient to remove the risk of offending some of our forum members, sorry)

 

It only takes one person to be slightly coarse at a show with their language, it wouldnt matter who the guest is, I wouldnt speak to any of our guests like that regardless of who they are, and I agree, Autographica has a more sedate and courteous feel to the event.

 

However Hollywood stars are the royalty of the film industry as far as I am concerned, and it is wonderful watching Astronauts/Pilots/Hollywood stars approaching each other at the show with reverence and genuine delight to meet someone from history, whether through exploring and pushing boundaries of space travel, fighting on our/their country's behalf or delighting and moving us with their acting prowess.

Why separate or indeed segregate these wonderful people.

 

Autographica is a unique show and if the organisers feel that moving it to once a year this year, and in a location that they feel be-fits the occasion, and can also pay for itself (they have already said that they dont really make money on the show but it is what they love doing), then I must say that I trust them implicitly.

Edited January 20, 2011 by Rhianydd

[Donkey]

With respect, your second post on this matter, has made me even more unhappy than the first.

 

If the main reason was primarily about the unfortunate illness, then you should have simply used that as the only reasoning. I think nobody here would ever doubt, that their recuperation is far more important than any show.

 

But there’s just something about the other reasons that simply doesn’t add up. There are documents on the internet proving that there were space guests available. I also agree that ticket sales is also such a red herring.

 

As a loyal customer, being mislead to cover up the cancellation, leads to distrust. I’d appreciate therefore if you could maybe explain the ‘no Apollo guest were available’ comment a little further.

[adriangill]

I am guessing by available you mean not attending another event? However it is worth considering that such guests may have things going on in their own 'personal diary' whihc clash with the event or may not want to attend at this time for whatever reason.

[Donkey]

I am guessing by available you mean not attending another event? However it is worth considering that such guests may have things going on in their own 'personal diary' whihc clash with the event or may not want to attend at this time for whatever reason.

 

One confirmed on their personal homepage. The other is personally fairly active on the internet. I just don’t understand how much clearer that can be?.

 

Hence why I kindly asked for a clarification, on the points raised.

[shearwater]

Autographica is a unique show and if the organisers feel that moving it to once a year this year, and in a location that they feel be-fits the occasion, and can also pay for itself (they have already said that they dont really make money on the show but it is what they love doing), then I must say that I trust them implicitly.

 

Sorry: this is just sycophancy! SMs are selling a product, just like Tesco or Heinz. Taking your customer base for granted and being economical with the truth is a route to disaster (As Gerald Ratner discovered.)

The root cause of most of the recent disaffection has been, without doubt, the well-discussed poor communication and indifferent organisation at the Thistle last year. Everyone there for the whole weekend was left in no doubt by two of the top guests that they were unimpressed by the arrangements: if (as they indicated they would) they went home and passed on their thoughts to their colleagues, that can't have helped recruit guests for Autographica 17.

Unfortunately (although posted in jest) the Count's comments above '...book it and they'll come!" is never going to be the case with any celebrities other than fading starlets and soap actors.

[showmasters]

 

Sorry: this is just sycophancy! SMs are selling a product, just like Tesco or Heinz. Taking your customer base for granted and being economical with the truth is a route to disaster (As Gerald Ratner discovered.)

The root cause of most of the recent disaffection has been, without doubt, the well-discussed poor communication and indifferent organisation at the Thistle last year. Everyone there for the whole weekend was left in no doubt by two of the top guests that they were unimpressed by the arrangements: if (as they indicated they would) they went home and passed on their thoughts to their colleagues, that can't have helped recruit guests for Autographica 17.

Unfortunately (although posted in jest) the Count's comments above '...book it and they'll come!" is never going to be the case with any celebrities other than fading starlets and soap actors.

 

 

hi Dave

 

1 economical with the truth , no sorry i am not , you are saying i am a lier in a nice way , its not nice i am

not

lying

2

your next point is the hotel , sorry this is a mute point , as i have said at the show and to people there and after i will not be running Autographica at that hotel again , so to go on about this again is a wast of time , the hotel before the show told us all would be fine the hotel the time before when we used it worked fine and the staff were good , the management changed and we meet the new team they said all would be fine , it was not and we canceled the booking for future events , that it there is nothing more to say its over and its the past , it was not down to us , it was the hotels that dropped its standard and lost Autographica

 

3

 

"fading starlets and soap actors" stop being so rude in generale about good people that have achieve things in there life just because you do not appreciate them , others do so just give it a rest

 

i think if you still have issues you should just ring me dave rather then keep on at it on here i am on 01908671138

 

i look forward to the chat

 

i am going to clear this thread in a few hours as its going off subject

 

jason

[showmasters]

With respect, your second post on this matter, has made me even more unhappy than the first.

 

If the main reason was primarily about the unfortunate illness, then you should have simply used that as the only reasoning. I think nobody here would ever doubt, that their recuperation is far more important than any show.

 

But there’s just something about the other reasons that simply doesn’t add up. There are documents on the internet proving that there were space guests available. I also agree that ticket sales is also such a red herring.

 

As a loyal customer, being mislead to cover up the cancellation, leads to distrust. I’d appreciate therefore if you could maybe explain the ‘no Apollo guest were available’ comment a little further.

 

 

point 1

 

maybe i was trying to not upset people that are dealing with these issues ? by putting more pressor on them , think about it ?

 

point 2

 

"reasons that simply doesn’t add up"

 

 

ok this is why it dose ad up

 

 

1 not much time to get a good line up .

 

2 low tickets sales .

 

3 no big first time Apollo guest able to attend may show ? and others were not around , one may have been available but no members of the public believe he would come this time as he had to pull out 3 times in a row witch is not his fault or ours but its a fact .

 

4 no big Film guest found for this show .

 

5 we are in resesshion and its harder this year than for the past 10 years every trader i talk to says this .

 

6 the past 3 Autographica's in a row have lost money .

 

7 you say "being mislead to cover up the cancellation"

again i do not appreciate you saying i am lying , i am not and you say it in a nice way but you are calling me

a lier , and thats not nice and rude however you say

it

 

sorry but if you need us to explain every point you should just give me a ring , its reel and we have a plan to fix it and it starts with running the event in Oct and having to cancel the May show its simple , all three of us are committed to Autographica and the event will continue for many years to come , but with all that we are dealing with this month its best to just skip this one .

 

jason

[shearwater]

OK Jason: I see your point and, yes, I'm probably guilty of over-reacting.

Many of the problems with A17 and A16 were obviously beyond your control, and I apologise if I've offended you or Dave...

I guess it's just too easy to type a post and send it up: once it's done, it's too late for second thoughts.

OK: I'll buy you a drink in October!

[showmasters]

OK Jason: I see your point and, yes, I'm probably guilty of over-reacting.

Many of the problems with A17 and A16 were obviously beyond your control, and I apologise if I've offended you or Dave...

I guess it's just too easy to type a post and send it up: once it's done, it's too late for second thoughts.

OK: I'll buy you a drink in October!

 

 

no need to buy me a drink mate we are all on the same side here , we both pay out lots of money to have a good time and meet amazing people , some times its easy other times its very hard the most important thing is we both keep going and make it happen .

 

i only want everyone to have a good time and get what they want from the guests they meet .

 

anyway we are cool and i look forward to letting you and the others collectors know of the guests we manage to get for the Oct event and we will be working hard for you all and our selfs , as we are collectors too .

 

 

jason