chrismk

Karen is the current star of the biggest Sci Fi show currently on air in the UK. Regardless of whether or not you watch or like Doctor Who (and I'm not really a big fan myself), this is a monumental guest announcement for Showmasters. There are many people who complain that their events always showcase the stars of yesteryear and whose lights have faded somewhat. This is a poke in the eye to all of them and is arguable the biggest 'current star' announcement since the stars of Heroes came to Earls Court.

For me it's Freema (although I'm a little biased, as my friends sister designed and helped make her red jacket!)

Did you manage to meet Neil Marshall at Collectormania a few years back?

A Dog Soldiers guest?? Get in!! I just hope he doesn't cancel, otherwise you'll have to say 'There is no spoon'......

For this event, the chances are zero. Whilst I'm sure SM/ME have the contacts, I think the costs would be prohibitive for a small scale event like this. If you're going to see those guests (and to be honest, I don't think Eric is the third lead character), it's more likely to be at LFCC or Collectormania.

Bloody.brilliant!

Not necessarily. Depends when you run the convention... True, but I don't think he's going to be available at all in 2011 1. Yes 2. I did Without Aidan, I don't think it will sell enough to be viable.

There is one other huge issue with a BH convention. The biggest draw cast wise would almost certainly be unavailable, due to shooting a certain little film in New Zealand.

Sadly, it's basic supply/demand economics. As a show like SPN gets more succesful (and goes to several seasons), then the demand for the cast rises. Supply of main cast is obviously limited (seeing as they are unable to clone themselves) and so the price goes up. Eventually, they will peak (either the show will end, or organisers will stop booking them) and the price will return to a more reasonable level (the difficulty here, is whether the fans still want to see them, or whether they will have moved on). Also, I don't think you can forget the role that agents play. I'm sure that some are upstanding people, who care about their clients, but as they get a percentage of earnings, you can't help but wonder if they inflate the prices a little. I'd love a Being Human convention (I had a ticket for Housebroken), but sadly, despite having 9 members of the cast (including the awesome Jason Watkins), there just wasn't sufficient demand for it.

It entirely depends on the guests. I've been to shows where the queue stretched right round Earls Court before! I've also been to shows where it didn't.

But often those small events are not financially viable, especially if it is for a current show and the guests are not prepared to commit until a few weeks before the event. I do agree with you regarding value for money, but at a weekend convention, you only get value for money if the guests are reasonable. You also take a bigger risk at a weekend convention, as the money is generally larger up front and non refundable, unless it get cancelled, even if the guests you want to see cancel. In theory, yes; however taking all the other factors into account as well, it may not end up as simple as that. It's certainly a good starting point. That's exactly it, it's a starting point and it's a better starting point than February or March, when many US shows are still filming.

Just out of curiousity, would you go to an MK convention if there was say 4 or 5 big guests that you really wanted to meet, or is the cost permanently prohibitive?

Surely it's an ideal time for a signing event? Even if many of the TV stars do other projects, there's still a significant number with no work over that period.

Two things, firstly, as I've said, you won't get more guests in total if you run less events, but you might get more guests PER EVENT, meaning more money through the doors. Secondly, of course you can't get some guests for financial reasons! If a guest asks for £250K (as a random example), then you can't get them, as you have no way of recouping the money. Are you familiar with the term 'loss leader'? This is where you sell something at a loss, on the understanding that knock on sales will make up for the loss. Supermarkets do it in their promotions, so you come in to buy something extra cheap and then do teh rest of your shopping there. Well it can apply to headline guests as well. For example Imagine 6 headline guests, all charging the same amount, all of whom will attract 10K guaranteed unique attendees through the door. If you run 3 events, you will get 20K attendees guarantees at each event. Run two events and you get 30K guaranteed attendees. The advantage of the second model, is that the secondary sales are likely to be higher (secondary sales being attendees buying autographs from other, smaller guests). Also, the overhead costs are way smaller (in terms of advertising, venue, crewing, etc). I realise this example is hugely simplistic, but it does illustrate that sometimes, less is more! See, I don't agree with this. If you take into account things like that, then surely you need to think about stage doors, premieres, store signings etc. They are "better value" because you get to meet people for free! And if an event organiser starts thinking about all of that, then surely they'd not get many 'big guests' because they'd tend to be the ones that would go to such things. And yet I've seen time and again that people are willing to go to signing events and conventions for the (mostly) guaranteed opportunity to get an autograph/photo with someone. It's a completely different situation, and I don't think they can think "oh there's a screening somewhere so we won't bother" because there's often many willing to do both, or that don't WANT to go to things like that. I realise you're trying to put things into context but if we considered all of those types of things as reasons not to run events or get guests then I'm not quite sure we'd have much left. No, the event he is referring to, was like a mini BH convention, where there was a screening, a talk by the cast and the opportunity for autographs and pictures for free. The only differences between it and an ME event was a) the organisation at an ME event is better it was only 1 day, not two and c) it was around £8 Can I just thank you for taking the time and effort to fix that mess, it's greatly appreciated, cheers! That's very true, logistics is a major problem for US Tv shows and films.... but there's no reason why LFCC couldn't showcase UK shows and films? Hell, BBC America has a massive pressence at SDCC. I'm positive Jason HAS tried to do the same thing with BBC/Sky/ITV, but for whatever reason, they've never gone for it. (although I am aware that Hot Fuzz DID promote at Manchester Gmex and Heroes were clearly promoting at LFCC). In my mind, it's this promotion that is key and there are a couple of things needed for it. 1) contacts within the industry 2) the LFCC presence and reputation needs increasing 3) pressure needs putting on TV studios to go there (which is soemthing we COULD help with!)

I'm guessing that you've never been to SDCC? It is part promotional, but it is very much more than that and isn't far removed from LFCC. It has guest panels (like LFCC), a vast dealers room (like LFCC), it has comic writers and artists (like LFCC). Yes, there is a heavy promotional influence there and I'm sure it's something Jason would love to attract more of, but sadly, transport costs of promotional materials, makes it prohibitive for the studios. LFCC could become more like SDCC, but it's just finding the right contacts and studios willing to invest. In some ways, it's a shame that Mark Millar didn't come to SM first, before doing his own thing, because LFCC is a good fit for what he wants to achieve.

well how am i to know which events will work and which will not ? with out trying to run them ? That's a valid point, but would just say that in a time of recession, it's possibly not wise to try too many out. i had 9 guests to a Being Human event with all but one main cast , were the fans flocked to meet just to main cast my Birmingham Collectormania show , so a full on con with 9 cast for i think it was £60 odd a ticket should have sold out only sold 56 tickets , so how do you know its going to work or not ? I admit, that was just baffling. I don't know if people mostly wanted to see Aidan, or the rival event had an effect, or whether the BAFTA sponsored promotion had stitched you up (because the Being Human cast did several no/low cost events around the time the show started taking off). Either way, that was really unlucky and I felt for you on that one. i will also say this year we "are" running less events , but if i start to run less evens do you think that other promotors will also do the same ? no they will run what they think they can run and there will not be any brakes between events so from my point of view i think that i should run the events i think may work and if in time they do work thats great for all the fans , if they do not well its still best to try and not succeed than to have never run Collectotrmaina at all ? think about it ? I think some other organisers are running slightly less events and their shows are certainly not as well attended as they were say 5 years ago. Mostly, they are in competition with ME and in truth, I think that having a succesful event like that, is down to luck and tapping into a show, just as it's making it big (like you have done with the twilight cons.) At least one of your competitors has stopped running show/film based weekend conventions. imagen if i had never had nerve to run Collectormaina MK 1 there were 5 promotors that came to this event to watch me fail and fall on my face as everyone knew that a free entry event would never work , as thats just not how events would work, funny that ? You can see it that way, but I think they came along to see if it would work... I'm sure at least one of them took some tips away from that event! CM 1 is realistically the daddy of UK signing events and in many peoples eyes, it's still the best. also the first con we ran others promotors and fans said it could not be done the way we did it , no event could be run were you got to do most of the events over the weekend and you had to clash activities over the weekend , well we did it and the people said we could not do it again we try , we sometimes get it wrong , but we learn and get it right next time . Yep... and that's why I attended many ME cons and I still prefer the format. The issue for me recently, has been one of guests and reliability. so i chose to have a go and try to make them work and some times they do other times they may not but we have done some amazing things and we still have dreams for more amazing events . It's great that you're still innovating, but like one of your rivals has done, maybe you need to let stuff go, to be able to move forward with new stuff? one last very important thing to talk about , the world is in a very hard place , recession is here and its hard on everything and everyone so for us to find it hard is not a surprise is it , so maybe we do ask for help from the fans of what we do , i do not think thats bad of us i think its smart as we can save wasting money on ads when the fans that like what we do help us to make the money that come is go further and it means we get more guests or have more money to spend on bigger names so i do not feel i should stop asking for help to promote in fact i think we should be asking more and if people like what we do they should help get the word out . That's fair enough, but the problem is that many of your fans, met friends through your shows and therefore it's quite hard to get the word out beyond a finite group of people. You've used national press for advertising in the past (and I'm sure that played a massive part on the crazy busy Heroes LFCC), but it only really works if you have major, headline guests who are household names (John Barrowman springs to mind). I've said before, but I think facebook advertising is worth investigating as a relatively low cost alternative. this is what makes us different to other events we are all fans and run by fans and the people that work hard at these events are all fans to , to whats the difference from all of you to all of us . I have to disagree on this point. I know that you are massive fans and you get as much of a buzz from meeting cool guests as we do.... but I know at least two of your competitors are also massive fanboys (although perhaps without your impressive collections!) too tall meet his wife in the line at C4 now he looks after the crew and helps us run these events , you the fans are us the promotors in a way , you may not have looked at it this way but i know the crew feel this way as we are all a team and make these event happen as a group , we even spend New Years together partying for 5 days together , so its more than just running events that work or do not work its a group of fans trying something new sometimes , giving it a go That's great, but it almost implies that you run events, so you can hang out with your extended family. Whilst that's cool (and frankly, if I had the chance, I'd probably do it too), it's not a good reason to run a huge amount of events and it's not financially sustainable. so we will keep trying and even though its a tuff year we will be here next year and the year after and we will have some amazing events in the future and we may not pull off all that we do , but it will not stop us from trying . I'm glad you're trying and I have no doubt that there will be some great events in future, but as others have said, I think this is a time to consolidate and grow the existing events, whilst cutting some of the weaker ones (not Glasgow, which is clearly doing ok). people used to say you cannot get this guest or that guest well we have proven that you can never say that anymore and if you try one day you might just get them so i think we will all keep trying . Again, that's great, but I think the guests have too much power, if you're creating events for them to attend (which they might cancel anyway), rather than fitting them into existing ones. this years cancellation is just a one off and i am not just saying this , never have i been out of it for so long because of being assaulted ,and with one of my business partners fathers having a triple hart op and another partners mum having kidney failure all with in 3 months , in a year when we have some of the worst recession figures for 90 years , so if we are not shining as much as we did 3 years ago then i think maybe this has something to do with it ? Yes, this is the first major signing even which you've had to cancel... and I think it's why a lot of people are shocked/surprised (myself included), but ME have had to cancel a few events now and it's sadly weakening your reputation and (along with other reasons) is changing the way attendees book for events (as it, leaving it late, rather than booking early). Of course there are unfortunate, external reasons behind it (and I think the recession is probably the most significant factor from a business point of view), but you've been trying to grow in the last few years, whilst others have worked to consolidate. well there is plenty in this for the few of you that do feel there is to many show to fuel your debate thanks for reading Thanks for taking the time to listen and comment. ++edit++ can't see where I broke the quote, please dear Mods, feel free to correct if you can figure it out! edited by QS because of broken quotes

Once again, it will not increase the amount of top guests attending. It will, however, lower SMs risk profile, because they will be focusing on the shows that actually make money. It will not increase the total amount of headline guests attending in one year (it will probably slightly reduce it, due to availability), however it will likely increase the number of headline guests at any one event.

I get that, but let me add this to the mix: There are 6 huge guests wanting to do events. 2 can only do May, 2 can only do July, Your guest can only do November and the 6th doesn't care and is available all year. You run the additional show in November and logically, you put two guests at each. Now, if any guest cancels, the show is in trouble as it is hanging on just one headline guest (and it's the headliners that get the large number of people through the door). My point it that it's better to run 2 events and just try and book the missing guest in teh next year (and be aware of the fact that in Hollywoodland, availability comes and goes, so it's possible that your 'November only' guest may find themself available in May/July). Also, as Jason pointed out, guests are becoming available at a lot less notice. If you have fewer events, you can book more guests per event, which makes it easier to add a major guest. Let me alaborate: You have an event like Roadhouse 2 with no guests. You KNOW that a major guest might be available, but won't know until a month before. The problem being that if you hold out for that guest, no matter how impressive they are, you have already accidentally excluded a large part of the potential attendees, who won't be able to get to the event at that short notice.

I agree mostly with this post. In my mind, there is a finite amount of attendees, with a finite amount of cash. If you put on 12 shows a year, then there are very few attendees who can do them all. Therefore you automatically dilute your own fan base. I think the attendances figures can probably demonstrate this. It's made worse by the fact that there is increased competition and also a recession (neither of which you can do anything about). As for guests, I can understand the logic that many events, increase the number of dates, which means that guests have more opportunities to find a weekend when they are available, however, the number of potential guests is finite and again, offering more choices, will dilute the shows. Also, the large number of guest cancellations (and the fact that guests don't want to confirm until the last minute) means that the possibility of a large show like this being cancelled, is greater. I wouldn't go as far as Mike, in that I think it's possible to support a couple more events, but I would much rather see 1 CM:MK and 1 LFaCC a year, with several headline guests, rather than a half dozen signing shows, each with maybe 1 headline guest. LFCC is the cloest thing the UK has to a San Diego Comic Con and I'd rather see it promoted that way. As for ME events, well I'm not sure this is the right climate for them. Certainly events like the Twilight ones are worth keeping, because the subject is hot and in demand. Likewise, the Stargate event is viable because of the huge headline act attending. I'm not convinced that the other shows are really viable though and I'd almost rather see the potential guests for those shows at a CM or LFCC.

Maybe it's becoming more common, or maybe SM/ME are targetting more 'current' actors/actresses? Either way, it seems to be a trend. Hollywood seems more stable than it was a few years ago, with the various strikes and it seems like the guests are more in demand and perhaps more picky about how they spend their time. With LFCC/CM it's different, because there are other guests to get people excited and talking and there is also often less costs for attendees, as fewer of them book hotels. I think that even with one of those guests, you'd struggle to sell that many tickets in that space of time. I know a lot of people who attend events and most have said that they couldn't do this one now.

Pssssttt... you can't menion other events! Yes, in theory, tickets would sell quickly, but if the event was in 6 weeks, you'd immediately reduce the potential number of attendees, because some could not physically make it. Also, you make the marketting harder, as you can only really advertise on teh website/forum and by word of mouth.

If you can't get big guests for events prior to 3-4 weeks notice, then perhaps that spells the end for events such as these? How many people can commit to something at that short notice? Yes, to their credit, SM/ME always provide prompt and full refunds if events get cancelled, but that's no help to people who have made non refundable travel arrangements (to get an affortable price). To be honest, I think they should cancel/postpone the event now, before anyone else purchases non refundable travel, because even if they CAN get the guest, I can't see them selling anywhere near enough tickets at short notice to make the event viable.

I 100% agree with this and I know it's sometimes difficult for people running events to figure out who those guests are. That said, even if it's a headliner guest, I fear that any announcement will be too late for a significant number of the 'waiters' to actually organise attending. I wonder if in this case, if they do secure this headline guest, that the format of the event be shifted to more of a day event, with cheaper tickets? Also totally agree with this (except it was worded much better than my response!)

Dear Simon/Will/Whatever you're calling yourself these days I think this thread is highly disrespectful (and frankly quite sycophantic). As someone who regularly supports SM/ME by actually attending their events, I feel this forum is a good place to air both good and bad stuff about their events. This will unfortunately mean that both good AND bad things have to be aired (if you don't ever hear the bad stuff, how can you ever improve?) Also, Jason, Mark and the gang have always encouraged us to provide them with feedback on their events. Most of the forum regulars know what has to go into getting a guest signed, but the problems only arise when there are threads created which increase speculation and excitement, only to fail to deliver anything (see TWO threads promisng announcements in the CM17 section for a start). Building excitement is good, but surely the better way to do it (as used by other organisers), is to get a contract signed..... THEN post a 'countdown to announcement' thread, before actually making said announcement. If you fail to deliver anything, then of course you're just going to breed negativity. Like you say, occasionally things fall down and don't work out the way that had been hoped, but sadly, it's become a little too frequent. I suspect that this has had a knock on effect of making regular customers (like me), who previously bought tickets for various events, wait until nearer the time. This has the unfortunate effect of making the event less viable (Roadhouse 2 is possibly evidence of this, in that the forum shows that a number of people have held off buying a ticket, which I suspect means that sales will be quite low). If you want to avoid bickering/sly comments/negativity, then I think you're probably better off avoiding internet forums as frankly, an obsequious forum where everyone agrees with each other is both boring and also missing the point of providing feedback.

They moved because Wales is cheaper to film in than Bristol Check out a review on Wikipedia. Actually, that isn't the case... I understand that it's more about internal politics, given as the show is actually made (and financed by) BBC Wales, so they wanted to bring it closer, so that their employees can work on it.